D.T. RobbinsLeasing by D.T. Robbins was published in August 2024 by House of Vlad Press, and it’s a hell of a lot of fun. I don’t think I’ve laughed out loud that many times while reading a book (to the point of annoying my wife). The sense of humor Robbins imbues into the novel felt tailor-made for me. It speaks to Robbins’ ability to tell a grounded, emotional, human story while also spinning a yarn with crazy shit happening on every page.
Cody Shrum: Now that Leasing has been published, you’ve been killing it with the publicity. My signed copy arrived with some Leasing business cards. That was the first time I’d ever been excited to get a business card. It features a smiling D.T., suit and understated floral tie, and the text: Victoria Lawn Apartments: Where dreams go to die. Don’t forget the QR code on the back to find the novel’s landing page on House of Vlad’s site. It’s very meta and also feels like authentic merch from the Leasing universe. Not to mention your book trailers! Hilarious and informative, all. A few authors like Kyle Seibel have also made some great book trailers recently. Is this the new standard in indie book publicity? It’s a high bar, for sure, but I also don’t know that I want to read any books that don’t do this going forward?
D.T. Robbins: Ah, thank you! All of that was really fun to make! I still have so many business cards left. I’ve got to figure out a way to give them away. Book trailers are interesting, I think. Truthfully, not every book needs one. I don’t even know if mine necessarily needed one, but it was fucking fun to record. It sort of added a layer to “reality” about the book, I think. Originally, I was going to record some employee training videos or a commercial of some sort about Victoria Lawn itself, but what came out was what felt a bit more natural. More than anything, it was fun and silly and I enjoyed it. And I think people are really good at picking up what feels natural and fun versus what’s forced. I’m not sure if I’ll do a book trailer for every book I publish in the future, but if it seems fun and doable, why not?
Cody: Man, I would love to see some Victoria Lawn employee training videos—I’m sure that would be so fun to put together! How did you conceive of these characters and a story like this? I will admit to not being the most well-read guy around, but I can’t think of another book that follows a leasing agent, let alone at a place like Victoria Lawn with this cast of colorful characters like Tiffany, Mel, and No-Nipple Tammy.
D.T.: So … about ten or so years ago, I used to be a leasing agent at an apartment complex not entirely unlike Victoria Lawn. For literal legal reasons, I won’t get into too much detail, but so much of what’s in the book is based on some actual shit that went down in some way, shape, or form. Anyone who’s ever worked at an apartment complex will tell you that they’ve seen some shit like what’s happened in the book. Maybe not always to that degree, but pretty fucking close. It’s funny because one of the early readers of the book before it was published told me later that she worked at a complex and felt like Leasing was an accurate portrayal of what it’s like to work in that industry. That said, Mel’s character is based on one of my best friends that I met while working at the apartments. It’s also why she’s the most stable of all the characters, I think. She was kind enough to let me take some liberty with certain events, but her wit, coolness, etc., is very much who she is in real life.
Cody: It makes so much sense that you’ve worked this job before—the language and story, details all ring very true and authentic. You may have inspired me to write the gym manager novel I’m sure is in me somewhere. Also, I love that about Mel’s character. She does feel like a true North in the novel, a buoy from the insanity pulling everything else down. It’s life-saving in a job like that to have a good friend to keep you level.
D.T.: I would fucking love to read a gym manager novel! I can’t even imagine the shit you had to deal with there! Yeah, dude, Mel was truly my anchor while I worked there. It’s why she’s one of my best friends to this day.
Cody: I got all the way through the book, returned to the beginning, and completely forgot about the way you open the story, and I laughed all over again. I think it’s an easy enough thing to forget, given the insane shit happening page after page. This is more of a compliment than anything, about how great that opening is, but talk about your decision to start there and generally how you kick your fiction off—did you approach it differently for your first novel vs. how you write your flash fiction?
D.T.: Oh, man. Good question! The opening lines of the book were sort of rattling around in my brain for a while before I even started writing it. I knew I wanted to write about the apartments, but I wasn’t exactly sure what angle to take. Did I want to focus on the residents or what it was like working in the office? It felt easier to write about the office because I’d experienced it. As a resident, life was a little easier because you’re holed up in your own world, away from a lot of the shit you see happen to the staff. The writing process was a lot different, too. With flash, it’s easy to sit down, punch out a thousand or two thousand words with a hard stop wherever. Leasing took almost a year. The first three-quarters came in a flash, but that last quarter of the book took a long time. I wanted to get the ending right.
Cody: Speaking of flash, fans of your work have no doubt read and loved your collection, Birds Aren’t Real. That was my first toe dipped into the proverbial D.T. pool as well. Most of the stories in that collection are fairly speculative—demons and ghosts and robot birds, etc. etc. Was it a conscious decision to kind of stray away from that realm into realism (with the D.T. Robbins brand of absurdism, of course) or did the story just present itself to you this way?
D.T.: I really did want to challenge myself as a writer. I’d never written anything close to a novel before. And most of my writing up to that point did skirt closer to speculative. I told myself that Leasing needed to be grounded, or … as grounded as I could make it for the sake of the story. There were a few ideas I had about including speculative aspects, but they all felt foreign and misplaced.
Cody: Leasing is constructed in short chapters, which makes you fly through the novel, but it also feels episodic. Each chapter is its own self-contained story/adventure/yarn but you build up from each one like Legos. Did you approach writing Leasing like you write your shorter fiction, or was it a completely different process?
D.T.: You sort of nailed it: episodic. I viewed each chapter as an episode in a large series of episodes leading up to a finale. Basically, just like a limited series television show. It felt right, sure, but I also really like writing that way. The premise of Leasing lends itself to that format, too. I don’t know if it would necessarily work in other books, but I’m kind of hoping it does because it was the fastest way to get out a draft that I felt good about.
Cody: As kind of a part 2 to that question, I love me a good chapter title and I think you do, too. A lot of novels these days stick with the Chapter 1, Chapter 2 nonsense. My favorites in Leasing are “When God Takes Dumps” (classic) and “Rick is a Son of a Bitch” (accurate). I think the existence of titles here contributes some to what I mentioned earlier about the chapters being episodic, each one being its own adventure. Where does the magic of your titles come from, and what are your thoughts on the downfall of titled chapters in American letters?
D.T.: Yeah, this is again another aspect of the episodic approach to writing this novel. I do love titles, but they’re never a make-or-break thing for keeping my interest. Sometimes titles can be really fucking bad, too. I’m reading Stephen King’s Revival right now and the titles of each chapter are God-fucking-awful. It’s just listing shit. I’d rather it be Chapter 1 if that’s the case.
Cody: I wanted to circle back to David’s job. One thing I loved about the novel is that this job, while maybe exaggerated, is something many people can relate to. David is all of us, trying to have a life and work a job that isn’t so soul-sucking that it drives you to kill yourself, but it turns out that is exactly the case and it’s also literally trying to kill him. His coworkers are interesting but mostly suck at their jobs. He has so many reasons to leave all this shit behind. And yet he toughs it out, manufactures reasons to stay. And I’ll be damned if that doesn’t sound like me in a few jobs I’ve had. Does that describe any of your past jobs? You mentioned having actually worked as a leasing agent. Was it like David’s experience? Any jobs where you got dog turds thrown at you?
D.T.: Oof. Yeah. I mean, I’ve definitely worked jobs that suck the life out of you, and that includes working as a leasing agent. But at the heart of writing this, I really went back to remember how I felt at the time of being a leasing agent: like I was a failure and had no clue what I wanted to or was going to do with my life. I’m not saying I’ve got everything figured out, but at 40, I’m much more driven and directed and happier than I’ve ever been. David doesn’t know what he wants. He’s there by accident. That’s sort of been the story of his life up to the point. It isn’t until he meets April, I think, that he realizes maybe he can do something else if he wants to. And that was a fine line to toe, as well. I really wanted to write April as realistically and honestly as possible. She isn’t a manic pixie dream girl. I hope I did okay with her character. She’s based loosely off my wife, although we weren’t together when I worked at the apartment complex all those years ago. And things obviously didn’t pan out like it did in the book either.
Cody: Before we wrap this up, I have one last question. You seem like a busy guy with a lot going on: Leasing was just published, editing for Rejection Letters, blasting the kettlebells, family life (and a new baby, congratulations!) and other D.T.-related badassery. I’m sure you’re not thinking too far ahead, but what’s next? Any new stories we can expect to see in some magazines? Working on a new collection or, I daresay, the next novel? Maybe a leasing agent gig in the works?
D.T.: Dude, I’m so fucking busy! It’s insane. But I’ve also given myself some space as of late to just sort of chill and not pressure myself to create anything. As of today, our baby is now almost two weeks, and between taking care of her and a toddler and two older kids while working, teaching, etc. etc. etc., it can be a lot. The biggest thing I’m letting myself do for me right now is continuing to work out … a lot. Lifting and all that just helps me feel good about myself and not like I’m turning into a lazy piece of shit. As for writing, I have started a horror novel(la?) that I’m writing very, very slowly. I’ve also got an idea for a screenplay that’s more along the lines, I think, of horror comedy. I’m most excited about that, but I’m not rushing anything.
Cody: Hey, man, a D.T. horror novella or screenplay both sound amazing—you’ll have at least one guy who wants to read either! But hey, man, thanks again for taking the time to talk with me, and enjoy the Leasing success while the rest of us wait for your next project to come to fruition! I’ll brainstorm some business card giveaway schemes in the meantime.
D.T.: Thanks for interviewing me! This has been fun!
More About D.T. Robbins
D.T. Robbins is the author of several books including Birds Aren’t Real and Leasing. He’s the founding editor of Rejection Letters and Twin Pies.
You can get your copy of Leasing (complete with Victoria Lawn business cards!) here: https://houseofvladpress.com/ or here: https://asterismbooks.com/product/leasing-a-novel
