Paul Neilan
Author
of Apathy and Other Small Victories talks with Matt Borondy
about why he rode Greyhound for two months straight, why he didn't
get an MFA, and why his generation's greatest potential rests in
its inability to care
Paul Neilan's debut novel, Apathy
and Other Small Victories, was appropriately hailed by
our boy Neal
Pollack as "a triumphantly, weirdly hilarious comedy."
It tells the story of Shane, a late-twenties Greyhound addict stuck
in a soulless job at an insurance company, who passes his time sleeping
with his landlord's wife in exchange for rent, getting beat up by
his corporate-climber girlfriend, stealing salt shakers compulsively,
and partying with deaf people. In the midst of being investigated
for murder and enduring the sounds of his upstairs neighbor's sexual
relationship with a guinea pig, Shane finds temporary relief by
sleeping in handicapped bathroom stalls, drinking Miller High Life,
and thinking up bumper stickers like "The world is your oyster,
but you are allergic to shellfish."
Here's how it all begins:
"I was stealing saltshakers again. Ten, sometimes twelve
a night, shoving them in my pockets, hiding them up my sleeves,
smuggling them out of bars and diners and anywhere else I could
find them. In the morning, whenever I woke up, I was always covered
in salt. I was cured meat. I had become beef jerky. Even as a
small, small child, I knew it would one day come to this."
And another clip:
"I didn't know what I was doing in that city. I never know
what I'm doing anywhere. I only know how I'll leave. It's always
on a Greyhound. It's almost too easy. They go everywhere cheap
and all you have to do is sit back and look out the window and
pretend that motion and direction are the same thing."
And so, here is my interview with Paul Neilan. Like they say in
The Big Lebowski, "He's a good man--and thorough."
Apathy is your first book and the dust jacket
mentions nothing about your educational background--or really anything
about you aside from the fact that you worked at a mind-numbing
job at an insurance company in Portland. Talk about your background
in terms of how you've developed your writing style. Did you follow
the now-typical path of getting an MFA in writing? Why or why not?
There's nothing about me on the jacket because I have no credentials.
I majored in English at school but I only took one creative writing
class. I think I got a B. And I never really thought about getting
an MFA. I'm too spiteful to take criticism constructively and I'm
only comfortable being honest about people behind their backs, so
workshops or group critiques were never what I was looking for.
For years I just wrote in journals and didn't really worry about
turning any of it into stories or stuff for other people to read,
so I guess I developed my writing style by talking to myself, like
some homeless people do. Only I used a pen and paper instead of
just freaking out on the street. If they switched to a different
medium they might be better off. It would probably help if they
had someplace to live too.
Given that you share a number of characteristics with Shane
(age, employment history, etc.), some of the reviews have blurred
the lines between your biography and Shane's—asserting falsely
that Apathy takes place in your hometown of Portland, for
instance. In what ways do you most identify with Shane? How much
time have you spent going Greyhound? Is it true that you offed a
deaf chick?
I know a lot about his shame and bitter humiliation, especially
when he's stuck in that cubicle as a temp. And I agree with pretty
much everything he says about how compromising and depressing it
is to work in an office and how crushing it feels. It hurts inside
just thinking about it. I'll sometimes get a little bit of his debilitating
cynicism, but it's usually only if I'm watching TV or sitting in
the tub. I rode a Greyhound for two months straight the last time
I was trying to figure out where to live. I'd never really traveled
around America, so I got a pass that lets you hop on and off as
much as you want and I went all over the place. I think I put in
over 11,000 miles total. It was kind of like the Bataan Death March
except those guys had better bathrooms. I highly recommend it. And
I want to make it clear that I've never murdered any deaf women,
or men either. I don't know how that rumor got started, but I've
taken a lot of shit from the deaf community because of it. I've
told them it's not true but they just don't listen. I guess because
they can't.
It seems like Oregon is the home of a lot of great young
and experimental writers, from mainstream names like Chuck Palahniuk
to small-press publisher-authors like Kevin Sampsell. In fact I
think Chuck wrote a book about Portland called Fugitives
and Refugees.
After "riding the dog" all over the country deciding on
a place to live, why did you choose to settle in Portland? Are you
more of a fugitive or a refugee?
Portland's an easy town to get by in and it's pretty weird, so
you can do your own thing without anybody hassling you or even noticing
if you don't want them to. I might have to rob a gas station to
make my rent this month, so I'll probably be a fugitive soon, but
right now I'm just some dude that lives here.
What's with all these comparisons
to Benjamin Kunkel's
Indecision?
I don't know. I've heard it's a really good book but I haven't
read it yet, and I'm not sure that I can. I'd be way too competitive
and petty if I picked it up now. I'll have to give myself some time
to mature into a better person before I check it out. I just hope
I'm taller than him in real life.
What authors have you read recently who have driven you
to realign your worldview in some small way and/or caused you to
drink heavily? Anyone worth recommending?
A
Fan's Notes by Frederick Exley, but it will make you want
less alchohol not more. Watching someone drink themselves into an
insane asylum, you see that's it's really not as fun as it sounds.
I definitely agree with Neal Pollack's comment that your
book is "weirdly hilarious." Did you set out to write
a comedy? Or is it more that the commentary is so sad/true that
the only logical reaction is to laugh?
Thanks. I did set out to write it as funny as I could, and yeah
I think that sometimes the everyday nonsense gets so absurd and
heartbreaking that you really have no choice but to laugh. You can't
go around crying all the time, now matter how much you want to.
People would make fun of you. I know I would, even though I feel
the exact same way. That's just how it goes.
Is our generation (at least those of us working crappy
office jobs and sleeping in bathroom stalls) ever going to care
about anything? What are we going to turn into? Is it our destiny
to become yuppies and start driving Volvos?
I think our generation has been called to apathy just as our grandparents
were called to defeat fascism and the baby boomers were called to
get divorced and fuck around for most of their adult lives before
bankrupting the entire goddamn country when they retire. But we
have the chance to do something really special here. Imagine a world
where people didn't care enough to go to war over anything. Where
some guy gets up in the morning and says, "I know God wants
me to kill the infidels and keep gay people from marrying each other,
but I just don't give a shit. I'm going back to bed." It would
be paradise on earth. This is our mission. I think we can make it
happen, but I really don't care either way. And that's called hope.
Your blog
mentions a bunch of reasons to buy Apathy, including "Buy
it for the Christian fundamentalist in your life. It will make them
furious. There's a guy blowing his head off on the cover for christ's
sake." Give us some more reasons.
Buy it for your 90-year-old grandmother. You can even pretend that
you wrote it if you want. Say "Look, Nanna! My first novel
was just published. Isn't that great!" She'll have no idea
what you're talking about. The woman's insane. Bring over some cake
and party hats. She'll think it's her birthday. Give the old girl
a thrill. Go see Nanna right now.
Buy it for the lady who's about to become your mother-in-law, the
one who's already trying to control your life and the lives of the
three children she's already pressuring you to have. Give her the
book one day out of nowhere, just as a nice surprise, and when she
hugs you, calmly whisper: "Don't fuck with me, Ellen. Don't
even think about it. Ever." Then smile at her like everything
is wonderful. Because from now on, it will be.
Buy this book if you're a redneck, and tell all your redneck friends
to buy it too. If enough of you do, it might turn into the punch
line of a Jeff Foxworthy joke. You love that guy. He makes you laugh
at how ass backwards you are. Do it for Jeff.
Buy it for anyone you know who cries in the shower, who drinks
in the morning, whose life only has meaning when they're asleep
and dreaming that they're somebody else. They will find comfort
here. And if they don't, it's not your fault. They've always been
this way. Some people are just all banged up. Good for you for trying
to help. You're a great person. Give yourself a hand.
Buy
this book or I'll take it personally, and I will have my revenge.
I'll steal your girlfriend or make out with your dad. It doesn't
matter to me. Whichever will hurt worse. My vengeance knows no sexuality.
You don't want this. Your dad does though. Yeah, like you didn't
know your parents' marriage was a sham. Come on. Open your fucking
eyes.
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